By Damaghosa dasa

Therefore, there is Garbhādhāna saṁskāra, to find out when the husband and wife should mix and give birth to a child. Therefore, in the Bhagavad-gītā you’ll see that sex life which is according to the principle of religious ideas, that is “I am.” So, sex life is not bad, provided it is executed according to the religious principles. So Garbhādhāna saṁskāra… Just, what is the idea? The idea is the child born must be first class. He’ll be able to become Kṛṣṇa conscious. He’ll be able to understand the śāstras, the Vedas. He must have the good brain. These were the ideas. But if they are not born in that way, like cats and dog, that is called varṇa-saṅkara. Varṇa-saṅkara. You cannot specify whether he’s a brāhmaṇa or a kṣatriya and vaiśya and śūdra. That is called varṇa-saṅkara. So varṇa-saṅkara population is not good. Varṇa-saṅkara. No caste. No designation, no definition to which class this man belongs.

So, at the present moment, because these purificatory processes are not accepted, even in India… Accepted, they’re unable. Everything has topsy-turvied. Therefore, the śāstra says that: “Accept everyone as śūdra.” Kalau śūdraḥ sambhava. There is no more brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya or vaiśya. All śūdras. We have to accept. Because no Vedic culture, no Garbhādhāna saṁskāra. They are born like cats and dogs. So where is this division? There cannot be. Therefore, accept them as śūdra. Varṇa-saṅkara is less than śūdra. So at least, śūdra they should be. So there is no Vaidic dīkṣā. For śūdra, there is no dīkṣā, there is no initiation. Initiation is meant for the persons who are born in brāhmaṇa family, kṣatriya family, or vaiśya family. The śūdra has no initiation. So, in India there are professional gurus. They initiate śūdras, but do not eat foodstuff touched by the disciple. So, there are so many things, that if he’s initiated, how he can remain śūdra? But they keep him śūdra; at the same time, they become guru. Sanātana Gosvāmī gives direction in the Hari-bhakti-vilāsa that: tathā dīkṣā-vidhānena dvijatvaṁ jāyate nṛṇām. If properly initiated, he becomes immediately brāhmaṇa. Dvijatvam. Dvija means second birth. Yathā kāñcanatāṁ yāti kāṁsyaṁ rasa-vidhānataḥ. There is a chemical process that kāṁsya, bell metal, can be turned into gold by mixing with proportionately mercury. Now here is a hint of chemistry. If anyone can prepare gold… But it is very difficult to mix mercury. As soon as there is little heat, immediately the mercury’s finished. So there is a process. Everything has process. Many yogis know how to make gold from copper. Actually, chemically, copper, tin and mercury, if you mix proportionately, it will be gold. So Sanātana Gosvāmī gives this example. As the copper and tin, these two metals, mixed with mercury, there can be production of gold, similarly, by proper initiation, by the proper spiritual master, one śūdra, even though he’s a śūdra, less than śūdra, varṇa-saṅkara, or caṇḍāla, he can become dvija, brāhmaṇa. So, our process is to make dvija. Pāñcarātrikī vidhi. Pāñcarātrikī vidhi. That is recommended.

śruti-smṛti-purāṇādi-

pāñcarātrikī vidhiṁ vinā

aikāntikī harer bhaktir

utpātayaiva kalpate [Brs. 1.2.101]

Rūpa Gosvāmī gives this direction that the initiation must be done according to śruti, smṛti or pāñcarātrikī vidhi. There is nyāya-prasthāna, śruti-prasthāna and smṛti-prasthāna. To make spiritual progress in three ways: by the Vedānta philosophy, or Vedic ways, or according to Smṛti. Smṛti means authorized books written in accordance to the Śruti. Śruti smṛti. Just like Bhagavad-gītā. Bhagavad-gītā is not directly Vedas, but the all the stanzas of Bhagavad-gītā, they’re strictly according to the Nyāya-prasthāna and Śruti-prasthāna. So, any book which is strictly written according to the Vedas and Vedāntas, that is also accepted as Vedic literature. So Pāñcarātrikī vidhi means that it doesn’t matter whether man is śūdra or caṇḍāla… Caṇḍāla means less than śūdra. https://prabhupadabooks.com/classes/bg/1/40/london/july/28/1973

NOTE—So the above quote gives us the sastric proof why Srila Prabhupada can initiate disciples in this age even though everyone is born sudra or less, which according to the Vedas forbids this type to be initiated at all.

February 25, 1977, Māyāpura Room Conversation with Artists and About BTG
Rāmeśvara: Just like this Alice Coltrane. She has done her small part. She made this record album with Govinda Jaya Jaya and Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: That is… That will be a good thing. But when he (she) does it properly it will be more effective, because there is… If one does not chant in the process, then gradually it degrades. The offense will increase. There is chance.

Brahmānanda: We want to bring them to the process.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is the ultimate. That is stated by Rūpa Gosvāmī,

yena tena prakāreṇa / manaḥ kṛṣṇe niveśayet
sarve vidhi-niṣedhā syur / etayor eva kiṅkarāḥ

that “Somehow or other, bring him to chant Kṛṣṇa or to become little Kṛṣṇa conscious. Then, when he’s little purified, then the vidhi-niṣedhāḥ…” He’s not rejecting the vidhi-niṣedhāḥ. Vidhi-niṣedhāḥ means regulative principles. It is not rejected, that… But when he’s a little purified, this vidhi-niṣedhā syur etayor eva kiṅkarāḥ. Just like one… First of all, let him become rich, get some money. And then, when he has got money, he can keep some servant, some assistant, some secretaries, like that. First of all, earn money.

Rāmeśvara: So, one step at a time.

Prabhupāda: Yes. But organized business means there must be so many men, secretary, manager. That is regulated. So, in the beginning, “All right, bring some money somehow. Then I shall…” So, you cannot reject this organization because he’s chanting. Then what is the use of writing so many books, the nāma-aparādha and other discussions, if anyone can chant?

Rāmeśvara: So, it definitely has to lead them to that.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So, we must come to that point. In the beginning you may be very liberal: “All right, chant.” We do like that, and I have done it. There is no regulation. But that does not…, that it should be neglected. He should be given affirmed, “By simply, whimsically chanting this…” No, that is not.

Hari-śauri: Niyamāgraha.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Don’t make it cheap. It has got a science. It has got a form.

Rāmeśvara: I’ve seen in some articles they have written to defend our society from the attack of deprogrammers, sometimes one argument they give is that meditation and chanting are being studied by scientists, and they are finding the effects to be good. Now…

Prabhupāda: Effect will be good. And if we do it properly it will be first class.

Rāmeśvara: Now, these scientists, they are studying Hare Kṛṣṇa meditation, but they’re also studying some other processes which are not authorized. And they are…

Prabhupāda: That is the defect.

Rāmeśvara: And they’re stating that in general, to meditate, to chant mantra, this is good, this is healthy for the mind.

Prabhupāda: That’s all right. The thing is that some way or other, if you are near the fire, you’ll get some heat, but there is a process how to take heat.

Rāmeśvara: Oh, yes.

Prabhupāda: That you cannot reject. “Because I am getting little heat, it is sufficient,” that is sahajiyā.

Note-So SP is laying down the overall principle here-in the beginning let them chant Hare Krsna then the rules comes later. This chanting has form, it is a science-not that I am getting some heat from being near the fire and that is sufficient

In the meantime, I have received one letter from Hayagriva, and he was anxious to come to San Francisco during his summer vacation. In meantime, I have also received one letter which is very depressing from Hrsikesa. I understand that he has been induced by Bon Maharaja to be initiated by him for giving him shelter, and this foolish boy has accepted his inducement. This isn’t very happy news, and I have replied Hrsikesa’s letter in the following words, which please take note, and in the future, we shall be very cautious about them.

“My Dear Hrsikesa, Please accept my blessings. I am in due receipt of your letter of March 14, 1968, and I am greatly surprised. I am greatly surprised for Bon Maharaja’s initiating you in spite of his knowing that you are already initiated by me. So, it is deliberate transgression of Vaisnava etiquettes and otherwise a deliberate insult to me. I do not know why he has done like this but no Vaisnava will approve of this offensive action. I very much appreciate your acknowledgement of my service unto you and you will always have my blessings, but you must know that you have committed a great blunder. I do not wish to discuss on this point more elaborately now, but if you are desirous to know further about it, I shall be glad to give you more enlightenment. Mukunda is not here. He has gone to L.A. Hope you are well.” If Hrsikesa writes you letter I think you may avoid reply. I do not approve both Hrsikesa’s and Bon Maharaja’s this offensive action. Hoping you are both well.

Note—here Prabhupada is laying down the overall principle-no proper Vaisnava will ever re-initiate somebody already spoken for or initiated by another Vaisnava.

So, the principle of re initiation is forbidden.

The real question is this-if somebody gave “initiation” but was never authorized to do so, is it proper again- to initiate this person?

So, let us look now at what constitutes “initiation.”

Dec 23 1970 Surat conversations

Devotee (3): In regard to worshiping arcā-vigraha form, you have explained that if one receives a mantra from a spiritual master who is not bona fide, that mantra has no effect. So I would like to ask if one is worshiping a Deity and his spiritual master is not bona fide, so that Deity cannot be considered the Supreme Lord?

Prabhupāda: Well, first of all, thing is if the spiritual master is not bona fide, how his mantra can be bona fide? Your statement is contradictory. If you say the spiritual master is not bona fide, then how his mantra becomes bona fide? If he is bona fide, then his mantra is bona fide.

Devotee (3): Then why is he giving instruction to worship the Deity? If the spiritual master is not bona fide, then is the Deity also not bona fide?

Prabhupāda: I do not follow. What does he say?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: His idea is that if one receives a mantra from a spiritual master, if the spiritual master is not bona fide…

Prabhupāda: Then there is no question of mantra. There is no question of worshiping Deity. These are all bogus things. If you are not… Just like here is a young medical man. If he has not received instruction from a bona fide medical college, so what is the value of his medical, being… That is… What is called? What is the technical name?

Devotee (4): Quack.

Prabhupāda: Quack! (laughter) (pronounces like “quark”)

Devotees: Quack.

Prabhupāda: A quack is not a medical man; however he may show all red bottles, white bottles.

NOTE-this is a very instructive conversation in which Srila Prabhupada reveals to us who can impart mantra diksa or initiation for chanting and worshiping the Deity. If the “guru” is not authorized then what he gives is also not authorized since being authorized and qualified constitute the basis for being spiritual master

Therefore, when one receives so called “initiation” from someone who is not authorized nor is he qualified, that so-called initiation is basically zero, or null and void.

Therefore, there is no question of “re initiation” when one accepts proper initiation by Srila Prabhupada himself thru his ritvik officiating acarya system. This then becomes the first and only initiation needed.

Antya 9.69–Kāśī Miśra continued, “If one engages in devotional service for Your satisfaction, this will result in his increasingly awakening his dormant love for You. But if one engages in Your devotional service for material purposes, he should be considered a number-one fool.

PURPORT-Śrīla Bhaktisiddhānta Sarasvatī Ṭhākura comments that there are many materialistic persons who become preachers, gurus, religionists or philosophers only for the sake of maintaining a high standard of living and sense gratification for themselves and their families. Sometimes they adopt the dress of a sannyāsī or preacher. They train some of their family members as lawyers and continually seek help from a high court to acquire riches on the plea of maintaining temples. Although such persons may call themselves preachers, live in Vṛndāvana or Navadvīpa, and also print many religious books, it is all for the same purpose, namely to earn a living to maintain their wives and children. They may also professionally recite the Bhāgavatam or other scriptures, worship the Deity in the temple and initiate disciples. Making a show of devotional paraphernalia, they may also collect money from the public and use it to cure the disease of some family member or near relative. Sometimes they become bābājīs or collect money on the plea of worshiping the poor, whom they call daridra-nārāyaṇa, or for social and political upliftment. Thus, they spread a network of business schemes to collect money for sense gratification by cheating people in general who have no knowledge of pure devotional service. Such cheaters cannot understand that by offering devotional service to the Supreme Personality of Godhead, one can be elevated to a position of eternal servitude to the Lord, which is even greater than the position of Brahmā and other demigods. Unfortunately, fools have no understanding of the perpetual pleasure of devotional service.Link to this page: https://prabhupadabooks.com/cc/antya/9/69

Some Conclusions from all the above regarding “re initiations”

Prabhupada himself has told us what constitutes initiation in many different places.

1.) Initiation is a formality. If you are serious, that is real initiation. My touch is simply a formality. It is your determination, that is initiation.”(BTG, Search for the Divine)

2.)”…disciplic succession does not always mean that one has to be initiated officially. Disciplic succession means to accept the disciplic conclusion.“(SP Letter to Dinesh, 31/10/69)

3.)”The chanting of Hare Krsna is our main business, that is real initiation. And as you are all following my instruction, in that matter, the initiator is already there.”   (SP Letter to Tamal Krsna, 19/8/68)

4.)”Well, initiation or no initiation, first thing is knowledge… knowledge. Initiation is formality. Just like you go to a school for knowledge, and admission is formality. That is not very important thing.“(SP Interview, 16/10/76, Chandigarh)

5.)”…unless there is discipline, there is no question of disciple. Disciple means one who follows the discipline.” (SP Morning walk, 8/3/76, Mayapur)

6.) Dec 10 1976…So anyway, from 1922 to 1933 practically I was not initiated, but I got the impression of preaching Caitanya Mahāprabhu’s cult. That I was thinking. And that was the initiation by my Guru Mahārāja. Then officially I was initiated in 1933 because in 1923 I left Calcutta. I started my business at Allahabad.

July 13 1971 lecture

Prabhupāda: Unless one is prepared that “I am accepting somebody as my spiritual master. I must accept whatever he says,” if there is any doubt, that “I cannot accept his words verbatim,” then one should not accept him as spiritual master. That is hypocrisy. One must be first of all convinced.

Srila Bhaktivinode Thakur from Jaiva Dharma….

Once a person begins to worship the Deity of the Lord with a trace of bhakti it is to be understood that he has sown the seed of his own food fortune and that he is free from corrupt ideologies.

(Note-So if this same person begins the worship of the Deity of the Lord but is infected with corrupt ideologies, then the seed of bhakti, according to the Thakur, has not even begun-or as Srila Prabhupada says-there is no deity worship, because there is no proper guru or mantra, and this situation which we now see in iskcon is causing the greatest danger to the Hare Krsna Movement)

So today many devotees have rejected their so-called initiations from iskcon thru some unauthorized guru. That is very good. Some of these devotees want to be formally initiated thru fire sacrifice and the system Prabhupada mentions in Madhya 15.108 CC as Purascarya viddhi. Some other devotees feel it better to just keep the name they received from some bogus guru and not feeling the need to get “re initiated”.

So, both approaches are good since real initiations is described above in 6 quotes by Srila Prabhupada himself. Some devotees feel they need to do this initiation again the way Srila Prabhupada described it and was done in his physical presence. Some other devotees feel, why rock the boat since I am already “technically” initiated.

The purpose of this article was to show both ways are good, but for someone acting as an officiating acarya for new devotees, then I feel he himself should show by example the he himself went thru the formal process of fire yajna, purascarya viddhi etc to set the example for future devotees. Otherwise the whole affair in the future may become cheapened. For who knows how degraded this business of initiations may become?

“Oh, just throw a banana and chant Hare Krsna-bas- business finished !!” We already have seen some so called “ritviks” misusing this position.

Hare Krsna    Damaghosa das